Trained as an attorney, elected politics was actually the Prince George’s County resident’s second career. And now, his third career as a cable news political analyst has morphed into co-hosting a new 7 p.m. daily show, The Weeknight, on MSNBC with Symone Sanders-Townsend and Alicia Menendez. The move into prime time, which begins tonight, marks a promotion for the trio after the success of their previous MSNBC show, The Weekend.  

With this in mind, we sat down with the genial former lieutenant governor to discuss Maryland politics, the chaotic 100 days of the second Trump administration—he’s been a loud MAGA critic— as well as plans for the show with Sanders-Townsend, a former Democratic political strategist for Bernie Sanders, Joe Biden, and Kamala Harris, and Menendez, a seasoned political broadcast journalist.  

The following Q&A had been edited for length and clarity. 

Let’s start very local. You grew up in a working-class family in the Petworth neighborhood of Washington, D.C. and then attended Johns Hopkins University. What was your major? What memories do you have of Baltimore at that time?
When I got to Baltimore in the fall of 1977, it was a very different place. There was no Harborplace. In fact, my freshman year, my roommate, and I would grab a couple liters of Coke and three or four bags of potato chips and go down to the Inner Harbor, which was largely an empty space with a playground. We’d sit on the swing sets at one in the morning, look out on the water, and talk about life. The next year they began a lot of construction down there [building the bulkhead and promenade] and what spoke to me, as a young guy, was just the evolution of things. For me, being at a place like Johns Hopkins was a big deal. But the changes that would come to the harbor were a big deal, too. Baltimore has always held a special place for me.

What was your major?
That’s a good story. I started out pre-med biology, and that didn’t go too well. At the end of my freshman year, I had a 1.25 GPA. I realized, very quickly, that as my mother taught me as a young boy, I am the ultimate arbiter of what happens to me. If you don’t study, you’re going to be held responsible at Hopkins. That was a very important beginning for me. And I switched from biology, pre-med to international relations. I did manage to turn the ship around and graduate, if anyone is wondering, and went on to a pretty good career there. I was student body president as a senior. 

That is a good story. So, let’s dive right in. What’s happened to the Republican Party? In Maryland, far-right candidate Dan Cox won the GOP primary for governor. The party’s base feels former Republican Gov. Larry Hogan is too moderate, and the GOP’s only representative in Congress is election-denier Andy Harris.
Next year, it will be 50 years that I’ve been a member of the Republican Party. So, I’ve had a long time to think about this. What I have come to appreciate is that the Republican Party has for many, many years been at war with itself. It has struggled to live up to the ideals of Lincoln and those that founded the party around individual rights and freedoms—versus grabbing hold of and holding on to power at any given moment. That’s a conflict it has tried to weather and has not been very successful at navigating over the years.

The party has gone in and out with bouts of nationalism, bouts of Nazism in the 1930s, bouts of segregationist tendencies with the John Birch Society in the 1950s, the rejection of civil rights under the Goldwater’s 1964 campaign, the southern strategy of Nixon in the 1968 campaign; and Ronald Reagan, who is my political idol, beginning his 1980 campaign for the presidency in the heart of Mississippi where civil rights activists were killed. Then, of course, here we are now with MAGA.

One of the big differences has been in each of those other instances that the party grappled with itself, there were leaders who emerged that held it true. This period we’re in now, whether it’s in Maryland or nationally, those leaders don’t exist. They’re too afraid, they’re too timid, they’re too worried about their primary. They’re too worried about a tweet, and they’ve stifled their own sense of the moment to lead the party away from its worst instincts. That’s been a big frustration for me. 

In terms of civil rights and voting rights, some of the things we associate with Lincoln and the early Republican Party, the party has done something of a 180. I assumed you’re a Republican because you’re a lower tax, lower business regulation, pro-growth policy person, as well as anti-abortion, given your Catholic background. Those ideals that you hold on to, and wish the Republican Party would kind of revert to, well, the GOP seems far away from that today.
Look, the party that I led in Maryland, the party that I led nationally, is gone. We’ve got to stop pretending that there’s some magic wand that can be waved to restore that. What will happen, is there will be this new generation of people who call themselves Republicans, and another [group] who do not call themselves Republicans. They may refer to themselves as the party of Lincoln and call themselves something else and identify with elements of the old Republican Party that a lot of people seem to reminisce about. 

But, as often say, you remain a Republican.
 The root for me is what do you believe? What do you stand for? Who are you going to fight for? And, and that for me, that’s where identifying as a Republican becomes very, very important because I’m always going to say I don’t care if you’re pro-choice or not, I’m going to stand for your liberties. Freedom in this country means the right to express your point of view and we can have that debate inside the party, and we can have it outside the party.

The fundamental thing that we see happening right now is that individuals are being locked up because they wrote an op-ed that one man didn’t like. That’s not Republican. That’s not republicanism. That’s something distorted and destructive, and I stand against that. I think all real Republicans believe as Lincoln did, as Frederick Douglass did, as many others before us did, that your freedom and liberties include the freedom to write what you believe. That’s why we left England, for God’s sake. What part of that journey did they miss? 

A lot of us have had these debates with family and friends. Are you still in touch with former Governor Ehrlich? He’s been a pro-Trump, pro-MAGA guy.
I talked to Bobby, probably a bit before Christmas. Saying hello, checking on him and his boys and the First Lady. We have a good relationship. I am eternally grateful to Bob Ehrlich for entrusting me with the opportunity to lead with him. We just laugh and have a good time when we talk. I don’t have a conversation with him about MAGA because I really don’t care. That doesn’t define my relationship to him, or other people. There are those who have defined their relationship with me that way [by speaking out against Trump and MAGA] and have broken the relationship off. I try not to go down that road. I don’t need to with Bobby. He’s a good man and he was a good governor. 

Speaking of Maryland governors. What is your impression of Wes Moore?
Wes and I go back to our days on Morning Joe. I was a political analyst at MSNBC and Wes would be on from time to time as his profile rose with the work he was doing at Robin Hood, and when the book he wrote [The Other Wes Moore] became a bestseller. His roots are Maryland. I always thought he was a very cool guy, very down to earth. I used to joke with him that he’d make a very good Republican, you know, old school, and he would joke with me that I’d make a very good Democrat.

I’m proud of his success, becoming the first African American governor. His success as governor is our success as a state. That’s how our politics has to be built, and unfortunately that’s not necessarily how it is, oftentimes, built. His skill sets are good, his oratory is incredible. We chatted shortly after his moving into Annapolis, and I just [shared with him] that he shouldn’t let people lure him into the trap of the glitz and glamour of being the guy, the nominee, the presidential candidate. Focus on the job as governor. If you don’t do the job, it won’t matter. If you do the job, maybe it will, maybe it won’t, but you’ll feel better [either way] because you will have done the job of being the governor of Maryland. 

You ran for the U.S. Senate from Maryland. Curious about your thoughts on Chris Van Hollen, especially in light of his recent trip to El Salvador to meet with wrongly departed Maryland resident Kilmar Abrego Garcia.
I’ve admired Chris Van Hollen since he was in the House. He’s always levelheaded. Every conversation I’ve had with him, I’ve walked away feeling good. He’s been a straight shooter. I’ve had conversations with other politicians where I walk away, ‘Where’s the nearest shower?’ His ability to move from the House to the Senate, it’s a testament to his constituent services, it’s a testament to his ability to speak on some of the issues. 

What he did recently in going to El Salvador to confront the government there on his own—without the help of the Republican majority who wouldn’t make it an official congressional delegation—speaks to his fortitude and his desire to be responsive in the moment. I would want that if I were a position similar to Mr. Abrego Garcia. Even as a Republican, I would want Chris Van Hollen to help me as my senator, so the partisan blinders are off. The need was there, and he responded. I applauded him for that. I think Marylanders are prouder of him for having done that because he recognized that the rule of law should still apply regardless of [citizenship] status. Once you’re on this soil, you have the protection of the Constitution. 

And Senator Angela Alsobrooks?
Senator Alsbrooks has beaten the odds in a number of ways [including as the first Black U.S. Senator from Maryland]. I think she’s still working to find her voice as a U.S. senator, as the junior senator, and I think she will do that. I joke with her that I’m still looking for that second weekday trash pickup, which is what she promised when she was county executive. But she is someone, too, who I think, can represent all Marylanders. It’s important for people in the state to recognize that while the state is lopsided, 2 to 1, in terms of Democratic registration, a Bob Ehrlich and a Michael Steele, a Larry Hogan and a Boyd Rutherford, can be elected. 

Last, but not least, your new show, The Weeknight. What’s your vision. Does it change from The Weekend? Is it reporting, analysis, and opinion? All of the above?
Everything, everywhere, all at once. It’s opinion, it’s analysis, it’s news. When you look at the three of us and how we complement each other, Alicia’s journalism background, the political communication acumen of Simone, the political spaces that I’ve held in various roles—it gives us perspective to share an opinion, to give analysis, to deliver straight news. 

As far as breaking news, [which you’ll have more of during the week], if something happens, we go into news mode and then a lot changes. The fun stuff, you set aside, because this is not the time. We’ll be in the moment. We’ll rely on the journalists in the field when we need to. I think that’s what is going to make it fresh. I think part of the appeal of The Weekend that we created a year and a half ago—that will translate into weeknights. 

One thing about the change, I think it will help us be smarter in relation to the stories that we’re following over the course of a week. I think it affords someone like me a chance to really get involved in the story [as it unfolds] in a way in which I can bring timely analysis and/or opinion, and sort of frame it or deconstruct it. But the overall idea does not change, which is keeping it real for our viewers and being honest with them about what is happening and why. 

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